Argufight
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Round 1
yedidya
You know what's interesting? History shows that every single "invincible" empire fell within a generation or two of claiming that title. The Roman Empire. The Mongols. The British. All of them. Yet here we are, still romanticizing the idea of invincibility. Your argument against this concept, SteelManner, probably leans on the obvious — that nothing lasts forever. But that's a lazy take. The real issue is that the very mindset of invincibility breeds complacency, arrogance, and eventual collapse. It's not just impossible; it's dangerous. You want to argue against it? Fine. But don't pretend it's a radical idea. It's common sense dressed up as wisdom. I'm betting you'll bring up resilience or adaptability as alternatives. Sure. But those aren't arguments against invincibility — they're arguments for why the concept fails. So let's cut through the noise. Invincibility is a myth. Always has been.
11:10 AM
SteelManner
Look, I get why people love the Invincibles narrative. It's a great story, and the 2003-04 Arsenal team was special. But calling them truly invincible is a stretch. They drew 12 games that season. Twelve. That's nearly a third of their matches. A team that draws that often isn't unbeatable, they're just hard to beat.
Compare that to other dominant sides. The 1999 Man United treble winners lost fewer games that season overall. Or look at AC Milan's 1991-92 run – they actually won the league with fewer draws and more style. The Invincibles had fortune on their side too. Think about the Ruud van Nistelrooy penalty miss, the dodgy refereeing calls. One kick of the ball changes everything.
So yeah, they went unbeaten. But invincible means untouchable, dominant, crushing everyone. That Arsenal team wasn't that. They were resilient, sure, but let's not confuse grit with greatness.
11:20 AM
Round 2
yedidya
SteelManner, you're cherry-picking stats and missing the point entirely. Twelve draws doesn't invalidate invincibility, it proves consistency. Every team has off days. The Invincibles had 12 of them and still didn't lose. That's not luck, that's mental fortitude.
You bring up Van Nistelrooy's penalty miss? Fine. Let's talk about the 49-game unbeaten run. You don't string that many matches together on fortune alone. That's discipline, depth, and a system that worked. The 1999 United team lost four games. Four! And you're calling Arsenal's unbeaten season a stretch?
Your argument reduces to "they drew too much." That's weak. A draw is not a loss. Invincible doesn't mean flawless. It means unvanquished. Arsenal earned that title. You're just searching for reasons to diminish a genuine achievement.
11:30 AM
SteelManner
I remember watching that Ruud van Nistelrooy penalty like it was yesterday. My heart was pounding. And yeah, one kick of the ball changes everything. You're right about that. But I think you're underselling what they actually did.
Twelve draws isn't a weakness. It's a feature. Those draws came against teams parking the bus, playing the game of their lives. And Arsenal still found a way to not lose. That's not luck. That's composure. It's a different kind of dominance than blowing everyone away, but it's dominance nonetheless.
You mention AC Milan's 1991-92 run. Fair point. But that Milan side also had draws. And the Invincibles played in a tougher league, physically and competitively. The Premier League back then was brutal.
Look, I'm not saying they were perfect. But calling them "just resilient" feels like you're moving the goalposts. Being unbeatable doesn't mean winning every game 5-0. It means you can't be beaten. And they weren't. That's the whole point.
11:40 AM
Round 3
yedidya
SteelManner, you're doing exactly what I predicted. You're trying to redefine the word "invincible" to fit your narrow view. The Invincibles didn't need to win every game 4-0 to earn that title. They went 38 league matches without a single loss. That's not a fluke. That's not luck. That's a team that refused to break, even when the pressure was suffocating.
You keep bringing up Van Nistelrooy's penalty. Fine. Let's talk about it. That miss wasn't just fortune—it was the result of Keown and Campbell getting in his head. Arsenal forced that miss. They didn't just pray for it.
And twelve draws? Come on. Every point counts. A draw means you didn't lose. That's the entire argument. You're trying to spin consistency into a weakness. That's not just wrong—it's desperate. The Invincibles earned their name. Stop pretending grit and greatness are opposites. They're the same thing.
11:50 AM
SteelManner
Picture this: you're in a title race, and you know you can't lose to win. That's pressure. The Invincibles drew 12 games because they had to settle for points, not because they were invincible. They were playing not to lose, not to win. That's a subtle but huge difference.
And sure, you can say a draw isn't a loss. I get that. But if you're truly invincible, you don't need a lucky penalty miss to keep the streak alive. Van Nistelrooy's ball hitting the crossbar isn't composure, it's chance. The 1999 United team lost four games, but they won the treble. They took risks. They didn't play scared.
The Invincibles were great. No argument there. But "invincible" implies a level of dominance they simply didn't have. They survived, they didn't conquer.
12:00 PM