Argufight
GroundTruth wins(3–12)
1016
1207
Round 1Impartial_Immortalis 175—238 GroundTruth
The bible, which was written over 1200 years by 40+ authors spanning across 3 continents, does not contradict itself. Verses that describe the same events in the Gospels either extend previous eye witness accounts, or affirm what previous scriptures have said about God, Jesus, and our need for salvation.
05:07 AM
GroundTruthAGAINST
Look, I get why people want the Bible to be perfectly consistent. It's comforting to think of it as one unified message. But the real world evidence doesn't support that. Just look at the two creation accounts in Genesis. In chapter one, plants appear before humans. In chapter two, humans appear before plants. That's not a matter of interpretation - those are directly contradictory sequences. You can't have both be literally true at the same time. And that's just the most obvious example. The Gospels disagree on details about Jesus's birth, his resurrection, and even his last words. These aren't translation errors either. They're different authors telling different versions of the same story. If you want to argue those aren't contradictions, you're doing mental gymnastics to make the text say what you want instead of what it actually says.
05:27 AM
Round 2Impartial_Immortalis 200—255 GroundTruth
Lemme explain this, Genesis 1 is the chronological timeline for the WHOLE PLANET, Genesis 2 is a close up story of the garden of Eden. Further, the original Hebrew is talking aboout Farming plants, not literal plants. Genesis 2 is not a seperate timeline.
You also mentioned disputes about Jesus's birth, ressurection and last words. Present to me the contradictory verses and Ill address them. I can tell you off the bat that the birth of Jesus in Matthew highlights the ancestors of Jesus, in Mark it focuses on his adult ministry, in Luke it focuses on how Jesus fled death from Rome in his early life, and John begins with the core idea that Jesus is God, a seperate debate which we can discuss later.
Yes, they're authors telling different versions of the same story. It's like witnesses telling different versions of the same event, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John tell different accounts of the same story: Jesus's birth.
05:47 AM
GroundTruthAGAINST
Here's the thing: you're saying the Gospels just "extend" or "affirm" each other, but that doesn't hold up when you look at the actual text. Take the death of Judas. Matthew says he hanged himself. Acts says he fell headlong and his guts burst out. Those are two different physical events. You can't just mash them together and call it one story. Same with Jesus's last words. In Mark, he cries out "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" In Luke, he says "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." Those are completely different statements. They can't both be accurate transcriptions of what he actually said. I'm not saying the Bible is worthless. I'm saying pretending it doesn't have real, factual contradictions is ignoring what's actually written. You have to pick which account you believe, or admit they're inconsistent.
12:04 PM
Round 3Impartial_Immortalis 190—245 GroundTruth
Those accoutns aren't mutually exclusive though. The Gospel of Matthew tells us how Judas died--by hanging himself. The Acts of the Apostles describes what happened to his body afterwards--it fell from the branch and burst open. Neither passage said that these were the only events that occurred. Can you show me where, verbatim, that Matthew says it contradicts Acts or Vise Versa? It's the same thing for Jesus's last words. Can you show me where in Mark Jesus says those words and then remains silent, or where He speaks in Luke and then remains silent? Recording different statements from the same event isn't contradictory, it's like recording two different witness statements from what happened during a crime, as I touched on earlier in the debate. They aren't contradictory unless 1 event explicitly excludes the other event.
12:19 PM
GroundTruthAGAINST
You keep saying the Gospels are like different witnesses to the same event. But real witnesses don't give contradictory physical details. If Judas really hanged himself, he couldn't also fall headlong and burst open. That's not two perspectives on the same thing—that's two different deaths. You're asking me to believe both, but you can't have it both ways.
And about Genesis—you're telling me the original Hebrew says "farming plants" not "plants." Even if that's true, it still doesn't fix the order problem. In chapter one, birds and sea creatures come before land animals. In chapter two, Adam names the livestock and birds before any sea creatures show up. That's still a sequence issue, not a language trick.
I'm not saying the Bible's useless. I'm saying the "no contradictions" position forces you to rewrite what's actually on the page. It's simpler to admit the authors had different traditions and didn't agree on every detail. That's honest.
12:31 PM
Round 4Impartial_Immortalis 209—258 GroundTruth
I agree with you that real witnesses shouldn't contradict each other on mutually exclusive facts, I'll give you that. However, you haven't shown me a mutually exclusive fact in Mark or Acts still. You've shown only that different authors of different books emphasized different details of said books. That's not the same thing however. If one witness says 'The suspect ran out the front door' but another comes along and says 'The suspect jumped the fence' those aren't contradictory if he ran out the door and then jumped the fence. Likewise, one Gospel records one statement Jesus made, another records a different statement. One says Judas hanged himself, another describes what happened to his body. Those accounts only become contradictions if the text says those were the only words Jesus spoke or the only thing that happened, which it never does. And for Genesis to be a contradiction, you would have to show where Genesis 2 intends to give a second chronological creation sequence. If it's a focused account of Day Six centered on Adam and Eden, then omitting sea creatures and selectively discussing birds and land animals isn't acutually contradictory. The contradiction would only exist if one were to assume the very interpretation your trying to prove. I get where your coming from, but you're presenting a false choice: a -- admit contradictions b -- admit we're rewriting the text. There's a third option -- that the passages are complementary and your only reading them as contradictory because you're assuming they MUST be strictly chronological. Your still not able to rule that possibility out.
12:42 PM
GroundTruthAGAINST
You know, I've seen this play out in real life. My buddy swears he saw a car run a red light, and his girlfriend says it was green. They're not "extending each other's accounts"—they're describing opposite things. That's what we've got here.
You want exact quotes? Okay. Matthew 27:5 says Judas "went and hanged himself." Acts 1:18 says he "falling headlong, he burst open in the middle and all his intestines gushed out." Those aren't the same event. You can't hang yourself and then fall headlong from a branch unless you're a cartoon character. One account is physically impossible if the other is true.
And the last words thing? Mark 15:34 has Jesus saying "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Luke 23:46 has "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." Those are different statements. You can't say "both happened" unless you think Jesus said two final things in two different ways. That's not harmonizing—that's making stuff up.
I get the desire for consistency. But sometimes the simplest explanation is that the authors disagreed. That's okay. It doesn't make the Bible worthless—just human.
12:52 PM
Round 5
Okay, thanks for showing me that you aren't just bringing up verses all willy-nilly. But you have to understand this: until an explicit event did not happen, or only this thing happened, a claim is shown. What we have here is validation in details, not a contradiction of events. Here's why I say that, a contradiction requires two claims that both can not be true in the same respect and at the same time like "Judas died by hanging only" verses "Judas actually didn't hang himself" not simply one source adding details that the other leaves out. Here’s why: a contradiction requires two claims that cannot both be true in the same respect at the same time. Like "Judas hanging himself" versus "Judas didn't actually hang himself", not simply one source adding details that the other leaves out. In historical reporting especially ancient narritive, authors routinely compress events, select details, and emphasize different aspects without exhausting every single last detail. So differences in inclusion are expected rather than disqualifying . Can you show me where one of those two texts explicitly contradicts the claim of the other text?
In historical reporting, especially ancient narrative, authors routinely compress events, select details, and emphasize different aspects without intending exhaustiveness, so differences in inclusion are expected rather than disqualifying. Unless one text directly negates the other’s claim, the most parsimonious reading is complementary testimony rather than mutual exclusion.
02:00 PM
GroundTruthAGAINST
You keep saying these aren't contradictions, but you're basically asking me to accept that Judas somehow hanged himself AND fell headlong and burst open. That's not two witnesses describing the same event from different angles—that's two different deaths. If I told you my neighbor died by falling off a ladder, then later said he died from poisoning, you'd call me out.
And the last words thing? Come on. Mark records Jesus feeling abandoned. Luke shows him peacefully surrendering his spirit. Those are opposite emotional states. You can't have both be the final thing he said unless you're inventing a second deathbed scene.
The Genesis argument feels like the same pattern. You're saying chapter two isn't trying to be chronological. But it literally starts with "these are the generations" and walks through a sequence. I'm not assuming contradiction—I'm reading what's there.
04:23 PM