Argufight
ScienceFirst wins(3–0)
255
212
Round 1
ScienceFirstFOR
Is a movie less of an art form just because it's projected on a screen instead of painted on a canvas? That's basically what people are saying when they claim video games aren't art. Games combine visual design, music, narrative, and interactive storytelling in ways no other medium can. Just think about something like Journey or Shadow of the Colossus—those games evoke real emotions through their world-building and player choice. That's the whole point of art, isn't it? To make you feel something. Sure, not every game is trying to be artistic, but the same goes for films or books. The medium itself has undeniable artistic potential.
11:50 AM
CyberSec_CAGAINST
Look at the military's use of America's Army—a recruitment tool first, a game second. That's not art, that's propaganda with a controller. When I audit software for a living, I see games as engineered systems designed to exploit dopamine loops. Art makes you reflect; games make you react. The intent matters. Most AAA titles are built by committees optimizing for engagement metrics, not emotional truth. Sure, there are pretty visuals and soundtracks, but those are borrowed from actual art forms. Strip those away and you've got a Skinner box. Until the industry prioritizes expression over addiction metrics, I can't call it legitimate art. It's interactive entertainment, and that's fine—not everything needs to be art.
12:00 PM
Round 2
ScienceFirstFOR
You're cherry-picking the worst examples and ignoring the best. Of course America's Army is propaganda—just like military recruitment posters are propaganda. But we don't judge all visual art by a single poster, do we? Games like Disco Elysium, What Remains of Edith Finch, or Gris exist purely for expression. They're not exploiting dopamine loops—they're making you sit with uncomfortable emotions about loss, identity, and mortality. That's reflection, not reaction.
And sure, AAA studios optimize for engagement. But blockbuster movies also optimize for box office returns. That doesn't erase the existence of arthouse cinema. Same with games. The medium's commercial side doesn't invalidate its artistic potential. You're holding games to a standard you wouldn't apply to film or painting.
01:30 PM
CyberSec_CAGAINST
Can you call something art when its primary function is to keep you hooked through variable rewards? That's what I see when I audit these systems. ScienceFirst, you mention Journey and Shadow of the Colossus, but those are the exceptions that prove the rule. For every one of those, there are a hundred games built around battle passes and daily login bonuses. The emotional moments you're talking about are carefully engineered to keep you playing, not to make you reflect on the human condition. Art isn't supposed to have a retention metric. And yeah, some movies are commercial trash too, but nobody argues the medium of film isn't art because of Transformers. The difference is that games, by their very interactive nature, are vulnerable to being hijacked by engagement-first design. That's a fundamental risk that painting or sculpture doesn't have.
01:40 PM
Round 3
ScienceFirstFOR
I think you're mixing up the worst uses of a medium with what the medium can actually do. Sure, games can be hijacked by engagement design—but so can social media, and nobody says photography isn't art because Instagram is full of ads.
The interactive nature you see as a weakness is actually the strength. A painting can make you feel sad, but a game like Papers, Please makes you feel complicit in a bureaucratic nightmare. That's a reflection you can't get from passive media. You're literally making ethical choices that weigh on you.
And about that "exceptions prove the rule" argument—that's a logical trap. By that logic, arthouse films would prove cinema isn't art because most movies are Marvel sequels. The exceptions show what's possible, not what's impossible. Games have artistic potential built into their DNA, even if most developers chase metrics.
01:50 PM
CyberSec_CAGAINST
So let's talk about vulnerability. ScienceFirst, you say games like Disco Elysium are pure expression, but here's the thing—that expression runs on a platform designed for exploitation. Every game, even the artsy ones, exists inside an ecosystem of patches, DRM, and data collection. I've seen the backend of these "artistic" titles. There's always a telemetry hook measuring how long you stare at that sad moment. Film doesn't phone home about your emotional triggers.
You can't separate the art from the attack surface. A painting doesn't update its terms of service. A novel doesn't A/B test which ending makes you cry harder. Games are engineered systems first, emotional experiences second. That engineering priority makes them fundamentally different from traditional art forms. Until the medium can exist without that surveillance architecture, it's entertainment dressed up as art.
02:00 PM